Jeremy Fox
Tonight is the first of Jeremy Fox‘s Smith at Saison dinners, which will last throughout the rest of the week, while Joshua Skenes enjoys his week off at the Aspen Food & Wine Classic. (See here for more background on Smith at Saison dinners.)
The dual connotation of “smith” sums up a lot about Fox — namely, the desire for anonymity and the reference to craftsmanship. The week is pretty much fully booked.
Jeremy Fox’s name has come up a few times since early 2010, when he left Ubuntu, the Napa restaurant where he earned a Michelin star and myriad other accolades in his 2 1/2 years there. But since then, he hasn’t done many — if any — formal media interviews.
We sat down recently to chat about a wide range of topics; here’s part one of our discussion. Stay tuned for further installments.
Scoop: Smith at Saison starts tonight. Is it going to be an evolution of your cooking since Ubuntu?
Fox: Yeah, towards the last six months or so at Ubuntu, I was simplifying, and that was a huge challenge — for everybody. It made things harder. If there are just three things on a plate, those three things have to be perfect — perfectly cooked and seasoned, sliced with a sharp knife. Greens not wilted. Less precious. Less fussy. But that doesn’t mean you have to shrug off the finesse and technique. You just don’t necessarily have to advertise the technique.
You said earlier that you won’t know what the menu is until you’re in the kitchen with the produce in your hands. What’s it like going back into a kitchen and creating again?
I’m not able to, you know, look at a purveyor’s sheet and put menus together. I have to have the ingredient, I have to be working with it and cooking it. Usually I don’t know what the dish will be when I start. That’s just how it works for me. It’ll be more of a product of everything I’ve learned over 15 years and not focusing on just vegetables or just meat, but focusing on everything — the plate, the experience, not being pretentious.
Whose idea was this dinner series?
Josh [Skenes]. I had just landed in Atlanta and turned my phone on and there was a text from him. I said, ‘Sure. I’m ready.”
Do you miss being in the kitchen?
Yeah. More and more.
Would it be fair to say that, over the past year or so, you didn’t always feel that way?
Yes. Definitely. Most of the time.
Why that change? Because I imagine there was a point where you enjoyed being the kitchen. And now it’s back. What made that change happen?
That’s the big question. [Pauses] I had to rediscover my passion for cooking on my own timeline. A few of my decisions were rushing the timeline.
Like what?
I would say everything up until now.
Since Ubuntu, you mean?
Yeah. Cooking, since I was 19, was my life. Everyday, 24/7.
How old are you now?
Just turned 35. [Pauses] You work hard for so long, and of course you want to be successful. And you hope to be noticed for your hard work — but that’s not why you do it. You do it because it’s what you love to do. I think chefs are, by nature, nurturers. They want to take care of people. When people come into their restaurant, it’s like people coming into their home. It’s not just a job. It is your life.
What effect did all the Ubuntu acclaim have on life and cooking?
Opening Ubuntu was probably the scariest, but most fun thing I’ve done at the same time. It was definitely not an obvious choice.
You mean given your background at the time, coming from years at Manresa?
Yeah, it was definitely a stretch for me, cooking-wise. The learning curve was huge.
So you opened Ubuntu. What came next?
Despite the reviews, we just weren’t that busy. Then the New York Times [happened], and overnight — different world, different life.
How so?
It just took off from there. Business was good. It was too busy for about a year, until crush. Then we just slowed back down again. We’re doing 20 covers a night, but there was still so much press and hype and expectations being built. So much attention focused on, you know, specifically me. It felt a little self-serving to be getting these awards or accolades while the restaurant was still losing money.
I didn’t allow myself to enjoy that ride. It never went to my head; it was quite the opposite. I wanted people’s expectations to be exceeded. Everyone in that restaurant pushed hard. We were all pushing to get better. Everyone felt a lot of pride in the restaurant and they saw what was happening, and they wanted to rise to the occasion.
Do you think you guys were exceeding those expectations that you were trying to exceed?
Overall, yes, I do. Every chef wants everyone who walks through the door to be blown away and be happy. That’s not really realistic, but we can try. We definitely tried. We all pushed ourselves really far and it definitely wasn’t sustainable for me.
The grind?
Not the grind. The grind, the work, the hours — that never bothered me. If I didn’t have time to sleep, I didn’t sleep. That was pretty common. I guess it’s a fine line between being uncomfortable with the attention and seeming … appreciative.
Do you think people muddled those two things?
I don’t know. I think I did. It was just constant everyday. There were photo shoots and interviews. You feel like you have to do it, because you need to get people in the door. But especially me, I’m more of an inward personality, I guess. So that part was challenging.
But you were doing it … And then you weren’t.
Yeah [pauses] … It was just time to go. It was actually a pretty long time coming. It was as simple as realizing things weren’t going to change, or I didn’t have the ability to change them — at least what I needed to have changed. It was a life decision.
What did you want to do at that point? Were you tired of the kitchen?
I had no plan. I just needed to get out of that particular position. I think I was pushing myself too hard, and if I kept it up, who knows, I don’t know. I knew it was time to move on, but like I said, I had no plan. And you know, for a while, I just hid out. I did other things besides cooking.
Like what?
Mainly, I started studying design on my own — of different mediums. Just everything having to do with aesthetics.
What’s the role of design in food, in your opinion?
I think I’ve grown in appreciation for artists of any kind. I don’t want to sound pretentious and say that I’m an artist or chefs are artists. But some chefs are artists. I have an appreciation for anyone who puts something of themselves out there for others. It takes a lot of courage. You have to be confident in your vision. You can’t be wishy-washy.
What’s your vision for your food? What should a chef be?
I don’t think there’s one definition for what a chef should be. I think a lot of chefs are two personalities, out of necessity. In the kitchen and outside the kitchen. I’m one of those people, but my goal is to just be myself, and not have to be the militant, stoic leader, but be human. Not have to be perfect, because that’s impossible. I don’t want fear and intimidation to be part of the environment in a restaurant.
Tomorrow: Jeremy Fox continues his story, discussing his post-Ubuntu life, from Daniel Patterson to Tyler Florence to gardening.
Previously: Smith at Saison: Jeremy Fox is taking over Saison — for a whole week [Inside Scoop]